Would you rather Michigan be undefeated going into the game or lose every game? I personally root for them to lose every week but I know others who want them to be as great as possible going into the game to maximize the pain if we beat them.
I've seen the undefeated vs undefeated matchup. More than once now. One of them a 1v2. Don't need to see it again. They can kick rocks. I root for them to lose
What is the biggest “what if” in the Ryan Day era? 2019, Shawn wade doesn’t get ejected for targeting, fumble isn’t over turned, etc… 2022, what if JSN doesn’t get hurt week one vs ND or MHJ doesn’t get hurt vs UGA… 2023 what if Quinn Ewers never transferred out and would have sat another year behind CJ?
Similar to this which recent non-TCUN loss is the most painful. My friends and I always go back and forth on Sparty, Clemson, Iowa, Purdue, Oregon, etc.
1. The tiers of OSU fans - do people born in Ohio and that went to OSU have a greater claim to being fans (greater excitement, pain, sorrow, etc.) than people not from Ohio and/or never attended OSU?
2. Do you hate losing a game more than you like winning a game?
The thing that my friends and I can never agree on is the thinking around valuing a win over Michigan more than valuing things like a national championship or even a deep run into the playoffs. I don’t know if you’ve ever done a survey on this, but I’d love to know what percentage of Ohio State fans would rather beat Michigan over anything else. For me, it has always been more about a national championship, and the rationale has always been about a natty’s value in attracting elite recruits from states like Texas and California and Florida that may not know much or be emotionally connected to the Michigan rivalry, but want to go to a school where they can play in and win a national championship. Don’t get me wrong - Michigan losses are a different kind of pain. They destroy me for weeks. I grew up in the Cooper era. But I’d still take a natty or even an appearance in a natty over a Michigan win if forced to choose.
What % of popularity of college football is due to the teams being part of universities? That is, if they were a feeder system to the NFL, like a minor league but with a draft component, but instead of being part of a University are tied to a city/region?
Most enjoyable run to a National Championship? 2014 (with wins over Wisconsin in Big Ten Championship to make the CFP, then Alabama and Oregon in the CFP) or 2024 (beating Tennessee, Oregon, Texas and Notre Dame.)?
Which was a more painful collapse: losing to Clemson being ahead multiple scores in 2019, and the game ending with that interception where if Olave went the right way, the sky views of the play sure looked like a lot of empty space. Or, being ahead against Georgia in 2022 by multiple scores, having three ridiculous play calls right after the Stroud scramble, and missing a kick where the ball did not even seem to appear on the screen it missed so badly as the New Year rang in?
Without Covid would we be talking about Ryan day like we did about Saban. COVID shuffled many players to the NFL that shouldn’t have jumped from the 2020 team. It left a decent 21 team, but the B10 was in a weird spot. Michigan wouldn’t have been what it was 21-23 due to the likely firing of JH. And UGA wouldn’t have been the power it was due to many of their players being sophomore in Covid and retaining older players due to less draft stock in an overcrowded draft because of Covid
Would anyone trade Urban's 7-0 record v. TTUN to remove a loss that kept one of his teams from a title game / playoff? 2017 Iowa, 2018 Purdue, 2013 MSU..
Obviously it wouldn't be in the same year. So like take an L in 2017 if it meant not losing to MSU in 2013.
Or come up short in 2016 2OT game to trade the 2017 loss to Iowa and get a playoff shot that season instead.. just a few examples. It kind of ties into the conversation of what's more important - national titles or rivalry wins. But more specific trade offs.
If John Cooper coached in the current era of the CFP-4 team and now 12 team, those teams likely would have made multiple playoffs and possibly competed/won a National Championship. If so, would we view Cooper the same we view Day?!? Is Day closer to Cooper than he is to Urban or Tressel and is benefiting from the current system.
Either way, good problem to have but attending OSU in the Cooper era, it was frustrating to never see all the talent never get a chance at a title.
Do you erase the 1998 Michigan State game so that team wins a national title…but you butterfly effect Cooper being untouchable as a title winning coach and not fireable after 2000, with all that entails.
One that people asked and I would refuse to answer - and then it happened: would you rather lose to Michigan and win a natty or beat Michigan and lose in the playoff.
This is an off-shoot of the Tressel v Urban thing, but my biggest unanswerable is what is the state of the program if Tattoogate never happens/never is uncovered. And more specifically how many national titles does Ohio State have by this point in that universe. We live in our world where there have been two additional NCs since 2002, and I think it’s a similar situation in that world as well. I think Ohio State gets one between 2011-2013, especially 2011. You would’ve had a senior TP, senior Brew Crew on the OLine, seniors Boom and Posey, probably the best Tressel offense since 2006 at least. And then on defense I have to think a more self-assured head coach would have been willing to let Ryan Shazier cook a little more, and if the rest of the season plays out the same you would have a chance to go up against LSU and avenge the 07 loss, and I would’ve liked their chances versus that team and that offense that was an affront to God. And then potentially you have three more bites at the apple with a Braxton/Carlos backfield. My biggest worry in that scenario is that after Braxton or even during Braxton is the Tressel regime getting stale, and does Ohio State become a Handsome Squidward version of Iowa. This is a school that never really had to reckon with an all-time coach slowly withering away, they’ve been fortunate enough to be bailed out by neck punches in situations like that. All of that to say that’s where I land, if no Tattoogate Ohio State bags 1ish titles from 2011-2013 and then what do you do with an aging Tressel who I can’t imagine had that many years of top-flight coaching left in him.
Is it better to watch a Buckeyes game buzzed or sober?
Would you rather Michigan be undefeated going into the game or lose every game? I personally root for them to lose every week but I know others who want them to be as great as possible going into the game to maximize the pain if we beat them.
I've seen the undefeated vs undefeated matchup. More than once now. One of them a 1v2. Don't need to see it again. They can kick rocks. I root for them to lose
What is the biggest “what if” in the Ryan Day era? 2019, Shawn wade doesn’t get ejected for targeting, fumble isn’t over turned, etc… 2022, what if JSN doesn’t get hurt week one vs ND or MHJ doesn’t get hurt vs UGA… 2023 what if Quinn Ewers never transferred out and would have sat another year behind CJ?
Similar to this which recent non-TCUN loss is the most painful. My friends and I always go back and forth on Sparty, Clemson, Iowa, Purdue, Oregon, etc.
Most devastating loss to Michigan State? 1998 or 2015? (The 1974 loss was also a bad one, and controversial, taking 46 minutes to decide the winner)
1. The tiers of OSU fans - do people born in Ohio and that went to OSU have a greater claim to being fans (greater excitement, pain, sorrow, etc.) than people not from Ohio and/or never attended OSU?
2. Do you hate losing a game more than you like winning a game?
The thing that my friends and I can never agree on is the thinking around valuing a win over Michigan more than valuing things like a national championship or even a deep run into the playoffs. I don’t know if you’ve ever done a survey on this, but I’d love to know what percentage of Ohio State fans would rather beat Michigan over anything else. For me, it has always been more about a national championship, and the rationale has always been about a natty’s value in attracting elite recruits from states like Texas and California and Florida that may not know much or be emotionally connected to the Michigan rivalry, but want to go to a school where they can play in and win a national championship. Don’t get me wrong - Michigan losses are a different kind of pain. They destroy me for weeks. I grew up in the Cooper era. But I’d still take a natty or even an appearance in a natty over a Michigan win if forced to choose.
What % of popularity of college football is due to the teams being part of universities? That is, if they were a feeder system to the NFL, like a minor league but with a draft component, but instead of being part of a University are tied to a city/region?
Most enjoyable run to a National Championship? 2014 (with wins over Wisconsin in Big Ten Championship to make the CFP, then Alabama and Oregon in the CFP) or 2024 (beating Tennessee, Oregon, Texas and Notre Dame.)?
Which was a more painful collapse: losing to Clemson being ahead multiple scores in 2019, and the game ending with that interception where if Olave went the right way, the sky views of the play sure looked like a lot of empty space. Or, being ahead against Georgia in 2022 by multiple scores, having three ridiculous play calls right after the Stroud scramble, and missing a kick where the ball did not even seem to appear on the screen it missed so badly as the New Year rang in?
https://share.google/Zho5STdXTNvDBnQj7
Without Covid would we be talking about Ryan day like we did about Saban. COVID shuffled many players to the NFL that shouldn’t have jumped from the 2020 team. It left a decent 21 team, but the B10 was in a weird spot. Michigan wouldn’t have been what it was 21-23 due to the likely firing of JH. And UGA wouldn’t have been the power it was due to many of their players being sophomore in Covid and retaining older players due to less draft stock in an overcrowded draft because of Covid
Would anyone trade Urban's 7-0 record v. TTUN to remove a loss that kept one of his teams from a title game / playoff? 2017 Iowa, 2018 Purdue, 2013 MSU..
Obviously it wouldn't be in the same year. So like take an L in 2017 if it meant not losing to MSU in 2013.
Or come up short in 2016 2OT game to trade the 2017 loss to Iowa and get a playoff shot that season instead.. just a few examples. It kind of ties into the conversation of what's more important - national titles or rivalry wins. But more specific trade offs.
Which of these two terrible options would you choose
1. Ohio state never beats Michigan again.
2. Ohio state never plays for a national title again.
I feel like this gets to the truth behind the Michigan win vs National title question that everyone talks about.
Jack Tatum vs Mike Doss vs Caleb Downs
If John Cooper coached in the current era of the CFP-4 team and now 12 team, those teams likely would have made multiple playoffs and possibly competed/won a National Championship. If so, would we view Cooper the same we view Day?!? Is Day closer to Cooper than he is to Urban or Tressel and is benefiting from the current system.
Either way, good problem to have but attending OSU in the Cooper era, it was frustrating to never see all the talent never get a chance at a title.
Do you erase the 1998 Michigan State game so that team wins a national title…but you butterfly effect Cooper being untouchable as a title winning coach and not fireable after 2000, with all that entails.
One that people asked and I would refuse to answer - and then it happened: would you rather lose to Michigan and win a natty or beat Michigan and lose in the playoff.
This is an off-shoot of the Tressel v Urban thing, but my biggest unanswerable is what is the state of the program if Tattoogate never happens/never is uncovered. And more specifically how many national titles does Ohio State have by this point in that universe. We live in our world where there have been two additional NCs since 2002, and I think it’s a similar situation in that world as well. I think Ohio State gets one between 2011-2013, especially 2011. You would’ve had a senior TP, senior Brew Crew on the OLine, seniors Boom and Posey, probably the best Tressel offense since 2006 at least. And then on defense I have to think a more self-assured head coach would have been willing to let Ryan Shazier cook a little more, and if the rest of the season plays out the same you would have a chance to go up against LSU and avenge the 07 loss, and I would’ve liked their chances versus that team and that offense that was an affront to God. And then potentially you have three more bites at the apple with a Braxton/Carlos backfield. My biggest worry in that scenario is that after Braxton or even during Braxton is the Tressel regime getting stale, and does Ohio State become a Handsome Squidward version of Iowa. This is a school that never really had to reckon with an all-time coach slowly withering away, they’ve been fortunate enough to be bailed out by neck punches in situations like that. All of that to say that’s where I land, if no Tattoogate Ohio State bags 1ish titles from 2011-2013 and then what do you do with an aging Tressel who I can’t imagine had that many years of top-flight coaching left in him.
Also in that universe how many championships does the big ten have?